I like to take pictures at the local supermarket, rather than in a war zone

"The spice and the source of beauty is – the flaw (...), the angel resides in the details" – György Petri wrote in his poem Smile. It seems that the 72 year old Martin Parr does the same with his photography: he makes imperfection beautiful, elevated and lovely, while portraying the most ordinary scenes of our lives. He's the one whose pictures you've certainly seen before, you just didn't know he was the one who had taken them. Parr is the author of more than a hundred photography books, an obsessive collector who is always creating, and one of the most influential artists of contemporary documentary photography. This rich and unparalleled oeuvre is the subject of Lee Shulman's documentary I Am Martin Parr, which Hungarian viewers had the opportunity to catch at a screening during the just concluded Brit Film Days in Budapest.

Parr started shooting on black and white film at the age of 14 due to the influence of his grandfather who was a hobby photographer. He stuck with the format for 15 years and although the central themes of his images were present from the beginning, there was still one thing missing: and that was the presence of the over-saturated colours, the almost intrusive close-ups, the unexpected cut-outs and the strange compositions in the midst of chaos. These are the things which made the world of the Epsom-born photographer become etched in the minds of several generations.

Parr switched to colour film in the 1980s, photographing the last of the Thatcher era's Mohicans, the working class, and the faces of the emerging middle class. As the documentary about him puts it: he didn't want to highlight the good or the bad, "just that which is". He has photographed the rise of global tourism, the world of local supermarkets, the beaches of the United Kingdom, the rise of consumer culture, the burnout of Japanese society, Grand Slam tournaments, all the while being able to constantly reinvent himself from project to project, always experimenting with different perspectives and formats.

Rather than criticising it, he just pointed out the materialism of the modern age (an attitude he still maintains as, for example, he loves Instagram) through the objects that symbolise it: the tiny earrings, jewellery, painted nails, tacky shirts, make-up. As if he could see ten or twenty years ahead, he was taking photos of food long before it was popular, and he was particularly fascinated by fast food, in which he found a strange beauty. His meme-like self-portraits were a grotesque visual experience long before the word 'meme' existed. It was his project entitled Last Resort that earned him recognition. This is where he developed his signature creative voice, a uniquely magical way of documenting: Parr has photographed ordinary people engaged in leisure activities. To this day, he captures people in their most candid moments, indulging in their hobbies and pleasures.

Parr, whose influence can also be observed in the images of a generation of Hungarian photographers, has divided opinion from the very beginning. He became a member of Magnum Photos in 1994, which sparked a genuine rebellion among the artists. Half of the members said they would quit if Parr joined, while the other camp said they would quit if such a generational talent was not accepted into their ranks. His wife, his friends and his admirers have all described Parr as an obsessed workaholic who still goes out and takes photos today. In the spring of 2021, he was diagnosed with myeloma (a type of bone marrow cancer) but has continued taking photos by getting around on a rollator. He is now better, his illness in remission.

We spoke with Martin Parr via Zoom. He is a poised, stoic character who speaks with a freshness and a vivacious calm that belies his age. Artists who know him are right, he is not big on small talk, nor does he attempt to make big statements on issues he does not know the answer to.

The documentary about you was screened at the Rome Film Festival in the autumn of 2024, and it will be shown in Budapest on Saturday. How do you relate to this film? Is it strange to see yourself on the screen?

I liked the movie and it wasn't stressful to see myself being filmed because I've done films before. So I'm used to it. I know Lee, the director, very well. So I trusted him entirely. So I just said to him, have a free run. And that's what he did and that's how he made the film.

You’ve been photographing the world for several decades. In what way has society changed the most?

I mean, I think the biggest thing that's happened has been the introduction of the smartphone. That's made a huge difference. I mean, you see it everywhere. You see people glued to their phones. So we've become a more insular world because of that. Kids don't play in the street anymore. They're just watching their screens. So it's a bit sad in one sense. I mean, the internet's a great thing and it's not a great lot for photography. Things like Instagram are very good but there is a downside to the smartphone because it makes us not deal with the world full on.

You actually had a project focused on this, where you only photographed people taking selfies…

Yes, yes, I did. And I did a little book of those pictures called Death by Selfie. Yeah, I called it that because people in India have a higher chance of dying while taking a selfie than anywhere else in the world.

Is there anything still interesting about this topic from a visual aspect? Is there a positive side to this change?

Well, the good thing is, I do a lot of pictures about tourism and you can actually have the event going on behind you. People look at it, having it in the background of their selfies. So you get both sides. Previously, you'd normally have to make do with the back of people photographing the thing in front of you. So in that sense, it's made it a lot easier.

I presume you're not familiar with Hungarian law, but in Hungary if you want to photograph anyone – except for mass events and public figures – you have to ask the person for permission even before taking the photo, and you need special permission for publication and even secondary publication. How might the stronger protection of privacy rights affect photography? Could this lead to a crisis in documentary photography?

I mean, we don't have those rules in the UK. You can photograph anyone you want without having to ask permission. The last time I was in Hungary was in the year 2000, I took a picture in a big outside heated pool. Everything was smooth, nobody there was asked for permission, and I didn’t even dream of asking permission, I just shot it. We should be realistic. I'm sure the Hungarian photographers don't ask permission to photograph someone. I mean, if you're on the street and there's lots of people walking by…they should just ask questions.

What do you admire most in people, what do you think is our most valuable quality? Which of those things do you look for in your photos?

Well, I think humour is very important in photography. I mean, I look at the world and I admire the things that really amuse me and I try to make sure that that amusement is in my photographs. And what I'm surprised is that why aren't more photographers taking pictures which have a sense of humour in them or a sense of satire? It's a crazy world we live in and there's a lot of humour to be observed. Humour is a good device to draw people in. I draw people into my pictures with humour, bright colours, strong composition. And then if there's any meaning to be found from them, that can be interpreted.

You've said before that you think it's an outdated idea that photographs can make a real difference, so you just aim to entertain. Although you have photographed a lot of difficult times in your career, do you still hold that view seeing the conflicts in the world today?

It's not like I've gone to wars or anything like that. I mean, I know we've got all the wars going on right now in the world and that's very depressing when you think about it. But I avoid them. But certainly, my colleagues in Magnum like to go to these places. I guess they feel a strong urge to sort of show them and depict them. I like to go down to the local supermarket and take pictures rather than go to a war zone.

You've worked on several Gucci campaigns, most recently in 2019, and your satirical approach is embedded in these photos, as if you were using the aesthetic of imperfection in a genre dominated by the traditional ideal of beauty. How does your work fit into the fashion world?

I think fashion companies now like this sort of sense of authenticity. And if people want authenticity, I'm a very good photographer to shoot that. So I think people are getting away from the beauty thing. They're a bit bored with that. So this idea of authenticity is something that comes up and that's why people like Gucci decided to employ me to do some images. And by the way, they don't take forever. They do a few projects with you and then they move on to the next photographer. They're very fickle, but you're very grateful to have had that spin with them because obviously they pay well and you might get some good pictures.

In the documentary, you are described as an obsessive collector who loves quirky memorabilia and souvenirs. You collect wristwatches with the image of Saddam Hussein on them, objects depicting space dogs, Osama bin Laden, Obama, Lenin and Mao Tse-tung, and allegedly anything with the Spice Girls on it. I just have to ask, why?

I mean, they're completely eccentric collections, which for some unknown reason have just appealed to me and I've gone out of my way to collect them. I like the idea of where photographs were used on everyday objects. So watches are something you wouldn't think of. I did it with towels. I bought shirts with photographs on. I just like to see photographs being used in every possible way.

Are you also interested in these historic persons and their stories, or is it really just the photos that catch your attention?

I mean, I've done some work around Margaret Thatcher when she was prime minister. I haven't started collecting Donald Trump ephemera. That's too much. You know, it would be too gratifying for him if he thought I was collecting it. So I've left it out. I did a few Obama things. It's very unpredictable. It's just things that occur to me, things that I find interesting and things I'm quite happy to put in my collections. And often when I'm doing photographs for a different show, I'll show the collections as well because photography is a form of collecting anyway. So, you know, I'm going out of my way to collect different scenes, different places that all add up to something together.

Has it ever happened that you didn’t dare pick up your camera? Does one need a lack of inhibition and courage to take photos?

Yeah, I think you've got to be out there, you know, you've got to just do it. But yeah, there are certain people I wouldn't photograph because I wouldn't think, they’d give me a very good reception. So I tend to avoid them. I mean, I've never – knock on wood – been beaten up by someone. And nowadays they often want to see the picture. And if it's a boring picture, which most of the ones I take are, I would just delete it. And so therefore they go away happy. But yeah, you do get people all the time coming up to you and saying, you can't take my photo, it's against the law, which it isn't in the UK. So yeah, that reaction does happen.

Have you ever found that frustrating?

Well, it's a bit annoying sometimes. It's just, it's an occupational hazard. You just have to bring and bear it, but you are going to get it if you go out and photograph people.

In the film your wife says that people often don’t even notice you, even though you are tall and are walking around with a large camera. She talks about you just hanging around places and shooting a few photos. Is this something you learned over time, how to sort of blend into your surroundings?

Yeah, I mean, I'm good at blending in. You know, I look very boring. I wear boring clothes. As you know, but people think, oh, poor guy is disabled. So maybe that's a good thing as well.

You were diagnosed with myeloma in May 2021, and since then you've been getting around with a rollator and taking photos that way. The film about you opens with one such scene. One of the most touching parts is when your wife talks about your illness. As she explains, she knew you were better when you started taking photos again – in intensive care. How did the illness change your view of the world?

I think cancer has, you know, some positive effects. It makes you appreciate life in different ways. It makes you slow down and think about things more carefully, about who you're with, your relationships to the world, to your partner, to friends. So yeah, I think I've learned something from having cancer and it hasn't stopped me photographing as you know. So I still go around with my trolley, and I photograph away. So I'm enjoying the fact that I can still photograph, even with my disability.

When you were in Budapest in 2000, you took photos at the Széchenyi Bath. Did you discover any similarities between the Hungarian and British society?

Not so many, really. I guess East Europe is very different from West Europe. I mean, we don't have many baths like you have all over the country in Hungary. We have one in Bath, but that's quite rare. So yeah, I'd say there is some overlap, but not so many. And of course we have a left wing prime minister and you have a right wing.

You once said in an interview that documentary photography is typically a left-wing profession. Are there no right-wing documentarist photographers? What does a right-wing photo look like?

I don't know, because I've never seen a right wing photojournalist or documentary photographer. And I doubt whether you have either. I mean, we know that in Hungary, there's lots of right wing around. So maybe you can tell me it's probably more likely to be there than in the UK. Is there a right wing photographer in Hungary?

I can’t think of one off the top of my head. I wonder why that is…

I don’t know. You tell me. You should ask when you show the film on the weekend.

One of my personal favourites is your series of self-portraits, in which your are photographed in front of the most surreal visual backdrops. It's almost trash, which I think puts you well ahead of your time. In the mainstream I've only seen images like this with a good dose of irony in the last 10 years.

I just like the way you could go into a portrait studio and go to them all over the world and you get a different type of picture. So I just explored what was possible and I'd go into portrait studios and say, please take a picture of me in that style of one on the wall. And that's how I collected these pictures. And of course they always ask you to smile, which I always wouldn't do because it's funnier if you don't smile, which is in itself an irony.

A while ago trash swept through the world in a huge wave of popularity. Everyone started making trash music, trash videos and trash pictures. Were you ever able to identify with that word, or would you call these portraits something completely different?

Well, trash, we see trash all around us and I often photograph it. Trashy food, for example, makes better pictures than expensive food. Yeah. So, you know, I'll just photograph whatever I see and find. I'm looking at trashy backdrops, you know, they help in the pictures. It's quite an interesting vision.

When I was looking for articles about you in Hungarian, I kept bumping into several Hungarian documentary photographers mentioning you as an inspiration. Zsófi Sivák, for example, said that she often thinks about "what Martin Parr would do in a particular situation". Are you aware of the influence you have had on photography?

Sort of, yeah, because people tell me that, you know, that they've been influenced by my work. So yeah, I'm sort of aware, but I don't spend much time thinking about it. And I don't go out of my way to encourage it. But I know when I do a book signing, you get a lot of people saying this, or, you know, people even sort of spot me on the street. Even in places like Budapest, I would be spotted. So that's quite nice. I mean, it doesn't get in the way of my life. It's just a nice little bonus when people do say hello.

In 2017, you established the Martin Parr Foundation, which houses much of your collection and is working to promote the work of other British photographers. What do you see as the prevailing trends in photography right now?

Well, obviously I look at ones that are interested in photographing, you know, doing journalism or documentary work. So I'm interested in the outside world. But if you look at photography schools, a lot of people are very interested in identity. They're interested in just looking at themselves. They're not interested in going out in the world and exploring it. So that's the type of photographer we try and encourage by giving things like bursaries and grants and giving them, buying their prints and giving them exhibitions.

Could you name a few photographers whose work is worth paying attention to?

Well, there's people like, say, Stephen Gill or Jem Southam. I mean, there are many brilliant British photographers who aren't getting the accolades and the recognition they deserve. So it's something we can do, to put their work on. Siân Davey, who we've got on at the moment, she's a brilliant photographer. Probably unknown in Hungary, but you know, the good work will get out sooner or later.

You pay special attention in your work to the British social classes, with a particular focus on the working and middle class. Do you see any change in their situation?

Well, I mean, the working class is getting smaller, I'd say, because people are getting richer. I mean, we're quite aware of class in this country, probably more so than, say, in Hungary. So yeah, it's so much part of who we are. So it's not something I would avoid.

Has it ever happened that someone tried to copy your style?

Well, I guess I do have a style and I know that people obviously might find inspiration from that. But you can never quite put it off in my style because it is a unique thing to me. But when people put my pictures into AI, I don't like the results. They're nothing like the pictures I would take. So I think it's easy to misinterpret. It's not just about brash colours, it's something else in there that's important. And that's a difficult thing for me to tell you what it is, but I know it's there.

You have a positive opinion of Instagram, but do you think artificial intelligence poses any threat to photography and imaging?

I don't feel that threatened by it. I mean, people asked the same thing about Photoshop 10 years ago, 15 years ago, and that's never been an issue or a problem. So I think AI will be a great help in medical matters. It'll be able to spot diseases before humans can. But I think in terms of art, I mean, I think there'll be a layer of photography – like doing shots for catalogues, things like this, the more boring aspects where it will come in. But when you need to get very creative, AI can never really replicate what a great photographer can do.

I’d like to conclude with an utterly trivial question. Throughout your career, you have photographed ice cream countless times, and you are also eating ice cream in the film. What’s your favourite flavour?

I like a good vanilla or salty caramel. That's a good flavour. Yeah, I'd say those two, they'll do me very well.